Is my brand new Tilley lantern building enough pressure?

Hello,


My very first post, and I'm a new subscriber to the forum. I have recently began my interest in all things pressure lanterns and stones. I find it very therapeutic and I just love the engineering of it all


So, bear in mind I'm a complete novice and really knew nothing and I hadn't joined this forum at the time, I went and brought a brand new X246B lantern from Tilleylamp.co.uk


I have since been on eBay and discovered the older, better built Tilleys and been building out a very small inexperienced collection. All ofy recent purchases have been runners, fixed by the sellers, but I want to begin to get into the restoration of them a bit more, but starting from complete scratch in restoration, but am very hands on and can strip an engine rebuild and put back together, so I would like to think, I'm fairly hands on.


So, my brand new Tilley is not building enough pressure I think, it splutters and barely puts out any light and this after I have pumped aprox 100 times. I don't have any problems with my other older model Tilleys which have the brass pump. It's just the modern Tilley with the Aluminium parts to it. I bought a Tilleys spare parts kit and fitted a new cup, but no difference. I have soapy water tested looking for leaks under pressure, but no leaks found. Do do I have a dodgy pump? While do all the older pumps on my old Tilley have greater pressure and I don't have to pump a 100 times like a mad man? What do you think is wrong with it? The control valve works as expected, but could it not be opening enough? I just think the pump is not building enough pressure, as when I push down the plunger there isn't the same amount of pressure as when I pump the pump on my older Tilleys.


Be very grateful for your thoughts please

 

Is the pump leather nicely oiled and supple ? It may help to add a little light oil (e.g. 3-in-1), massage it in splaying the leather a little as you do so.

 

Hi Henry, thanks for your reply, I soaked the new leather cup for 24hours in kerosene, then dried it off and gave it a soaking in 3in1 for about 5 mins - it felt to me certainly softer than before I put it in the kerosene 24 hours early. Should I have done it for longer?

 

Welcome aboard!

 

I use motor oil to soak all my leather cup

 

Why dont you try the lamp with a pump off another lamp see if its any better first before blaming the alloy pump brass ones will fit.
Cheers pete

 

Hi Pete, the all brass pump looked larger diameter so I hadn't tried one on the X246B - I will try that - thanks!

 

Welcome to CPL @Richard Thompson

As Pete said, swap the pumps. If that doesn't help try swapping parts with one of the good lanterns. Try the vapouriser next then so on. I find it reassuring to try the suspect parts on a good lantern to judge their performance.

 

Pressure issues in Tilleys are often problematical .. pay attention to the bottom of the pump , the small grommet which fits on the spring .. check these make sure they are ok fitting and the spring holds it and seems strong .. not too strong as it has to flex .. make sure the bottom of the pump body is screwed on tight and a small smear of grease on the threads works wonders. Make sure the larger washer on the pump body is snug .. grease again .. and also the control unit is snug and vapouriser tube washer is good .. I find copper grease very good for seals. Tilleys work on pressure .. and do not fill up with kerosene you use 'too full ' in the tank.. about half fullis right .. too much oil not good for pressure .. good luck m8tey.

 

Hullo @Richard Thompson

some great advice there and about using/checking the newer tilley parts on trusted working lamps sometimes the only way to make sure?
Hours of fun

It’s interesting that Tilley have gone back to a pump with a Brass cylinder?
They were like this then they were all Alloy?

 

Thanks Alby - bearing in mind this is a brand new factory fresh lantern, I am a bit annoyed it's not working, but hey, I'm learning a lot from everyone s suggestions. I will try this pump in another Tilley that I have that is working. If it doesn't work in the other Tilley, I will strip this new pump down and see if I can see the fault, checking what you have advised

 

Thanks Robbo55 and Podbros I knew when I was getting into this that these lanterns can be needy an exasperating, just wasn't expecting it with a brand new one!

 

That really is terrible that you got a brand new X246B and you are having this trouble with it.
Now I understand why members on this Forum say to stay away from new X246B from Tilley.
Selling lamps like that how are they still even in business?
I suppose they just don't know how to make top quality products anymore.
At least you're getting help from the real experts on this Forum. I hope you sort it all out.
Also thanks for posting this thread as I was going to buy one from Tilley, just so I could have an unfired lamp in my collection.
Not anymore I will save my money.
How long have you had this lamp for?

 

About 3 weeks!

 

OK, quick update on trying out a pump form my other Tilleys. What I shluld have told you was that my other Tilleys are a KL80, TL10, and Guardsman - and the pumps on those have the thread on the outisde, so I can't screw the pump into the tank on the X246B

 

I think the next thing Im going to do is to strip down the pump as Alby said. I could contact Tilleys as this brand new 3 week old lantern is in warranty, but stripping it down will be good practise for me.

 

Looking at the pic - the tank doesn't look 3 weeks old! - the lantern is kept outside under cover at the moment to be used in the evening and so has go a bit damp and could do with a polish , which is what I will do when I strip the pump down.

 

I would swap over all of these parts in the diagram from your TL10 pump, to your X246B pump.
The older style works better and see if that helps. Just my 20 cents worth.

 

Wouldn't leave it outside, there are steel parts that will rust if exposed to the elements.

 

Thanks for the diagram Buggerlugs I will strip the pump down later this week when it quitens down a bit.

 

Hi James - thanks for the advice. the lantern is under cover. All of my lanterns gets used - I take them camping with me each weekend - I don't have them sitting in display cases, or sat in workshops gathering dust. They are oiled and will be serviced at the end of the season

 

Every night, I take one outside into the shelter in the garden and read by it, enjoying the design, the history, the warm light, the sound of it burning - I use them every single day

 

You can buy item 611 on ebay. I bought a pack of 10 and change the two square seals in newer Tilleys as a matter of course. The existing springs work and I use fettlbox seal kits which come with the round seals.

 

Hi Fireexit1 - many thanks for the advice, I will try that out

 

I have made some progress though. As part of my diagnosis, of why the lamp wasn't bright, and felt this was due to low pressure - the plunger just wasn't putting up much resistance, so I put in a new leather cup after soaking the cup in kerosene over night. I took the leather cup off and had it soaking in 3in1 oiled for the last three days - Rembered Henry s advice about really soaking it in oil. Then re- assembled and now when I pump, the last bit of travel with the plunger now has resistance nearly similar to my other Tilleys. The mantle is much brighter, but not too bright, like my Petromax HK500 which is too bright - I prefer more intimate, romantic warm lighting. So, I'm now pleased.

A huge big thank you to everyone for their advice - and have stored away the suggestions for future use.

Richard

 

Hi Fireexit1 - I have just been on eBay looking for the fettlebox seal kits you are you are referring too, but couldn't see them - could you kindly ping me a link to it? Thank you very much.

Also, this is what you are referring to for part 611?
TILLEY VALVE GUIDE SPRING pack 5 LAMP CONTROL COCK / PUMP 611 TILLY vintage nos | eBay

 

I have to say, that my experience of brand new Tilley X246b has been a lot of hard work. All my other much, much older lamps work like a dream - in this case more modern is worse!

 

There's a link to Fettlebox at top right of this page.

 

Well although your new lantern has led to a bit of effort, it has taught you a few things that will be useful for other lanterns. I bought the 611s but minus the springs. The fettlebox kit is made of Viton a synthetic rubber that will outlast the standard seals. Oiling pump cups is a must as you have found. Good job