Looking for 238B Documentations and Diagrams.

So I was blessed with such opportunity to come across a Coleman '51 238B and it's currently in transit to my possession the coming week. At a glance there's nary a rust spot from the looks and it just needs a good soap wash. PO said it was found full of Kero (Blessing or curse, It could be protecting the fount inside from rust... or make rust, who knows!).

Anyways, I'm going to be spending much time fettling what I can and was wondering if anyone can be so kind to help me source any form of documentation, diagrams or literature that can assist me in fettling this rare piece.

 

I have never seen an instruction leaflet for 238B but I do have this PDF which shows all the parts which should help some. ::Neil::

 

Well ain't that something, is that a petromax manometer I spot in the diagram? That's something I never noticed on my time researching what I could gather, most I've seen pictures of have the bleeder cap.

 

Seems to be but I don't think I've ever seen one on a Coleman either. ::Neil::

 

Interesting, and like @Mackburner says, I’ve not seen one on a Coleman, either.

The illustrations given above by Neil are in an Australian catalogue published by CJ Thomas & Son who owned the Coleman Quicklite Co. of Australia and were Coleman agents in Australia from 1923 to 1960 or so. The catalogue is here:

https://classicpressurelamps.com/threads/coleman-thomas-australia-catalogue-1950s.12630/

I note that the part numbers listed in the catalogue largely reflect model numbers, eg 238B-159, 220B-509, 236-423 etc. But while the manometer is illustrated with the number 253-140 it’s not listed in the part list.

Cheers

Tony

 

Actually, now that I see this diagram, I thought the image in another older thread was a fluke. The manometer seen in this photo in the thread maybe genuine, someone has found the elusive "238BG".

Apparently it was described in the Coleman collector book briefly, also indicating it was also never seen in the wild, possibly a prototype.

Coleman 238B up for grabs

 

@Dashwood, @Mackburner & @phaedrus42

Interesting that that example from RSA and the Australian illustration show the manometer. It seems that the 238B with the manometer was an export item.

Very interesting indeed.


Cheers

Tony

 

A ColMax manometer would fit the 238b too

 

Are those hard to source?

 

Colmax manometer:

The third link clearly shows the manometer branded as Coleman.

Colmax coleman

https://classicpressurelamps.com/threads/1960-colmax-advert.8425/

1960's Coleman Col-Max 333, 350 cp

Cheers

Tony

 

Would be nice if I can find a colemax manometer, would compliment the 238B nicely.

 

@Dashwood i have found three col-max and none of them came with one

 

Is there any lighting instructions for the 238B?

 

The Coleman 238B "Prince" was very likely an export model. Seldom found in the US. I'm not sure about Canada.
Possibly another effort by Coleman to secure a chunk of the market in areas where the Petromax-styled ones dominated...Asia, South Africa,...

In case you ever encounter a tricky situation with the rapid-starter, then this might help to some extents:-
It should be similar to the one for the 238A.

 

Mine's likely an Australian or Canadian model as it doesn't seem to have the Bulgarian/French instruction placard riveted on the collar. It has the bold embossed stamp indicating the model and generator.

 

BULGARIAN/French etc????? My goodness, that must be a one-of-a-kind then!

 

Apologies, Belgium.

 

I’m not sure what you mean, here. Only some models of Coleman lanterns (models 249, 242B) were made in Australia (in the 1950s and 1960). Therefore the 238Bs sold in Australia must have been manufactured in the USA or Canada.

I’ve got one (sans manometer) in my shed in the fettling queue. I’ll see where it was made.

Cheers

Tony

 

Update everyone, turns out I need a new pip for the foot valve and I need the dimension of the replacement. I plan on getting the tool probably this week and punch out my own pip. The pip is annular with a metal "cup" in the middle where the pushrod rests and presses against for operation.

 

From Neil's pdf above, the 238B has a knurled fuel cap with pressure release screw, rather than a manometer cap. From memory, it has the same size and screw thread as the Petromax manometer fuel caps and non-manometer winged fuel caps. A non-original fuel cap that fits should not be hard to find from a Pmax or clone.

 

Hmm, wouldn't look "Coleman" so I'd stick with whatever it came with.

On another note, has anyone ever repacked a stem on these lanterns? It's nothing I've ever seen, can't seem to get the nut apart, feels like it was never intended to separate.

 

Often better to get it running, even with borrowed or unoriginal parts, while searching for the right bits. The graphite packing is inside the jamb nut. Sometimes it gets a bit gummed up and tight after standing a long time. A bit of heat after removing the wheel should get it loose.

 

On a plus note, petromax burner caps do fit into the 238B mixing chamber like a glove, that means I can remove the Coleman branded one for preservation.

 

Or you can simply purchase one without the 'Petromax' stamp from the Fettlebox.

 

On another focus on my fettle, is there anything I can substitute for the petrified o-ring pip for the foot valve, I scooped out what's left of the rotten pip which now leaves me with an empty brass cup with a dimpled post where the pushrod of the eccentric acts on.

It's part 253-504 on the diagram.

 

The basic workings of the Coleman 238B is essentially similar to that of a Petromax. It only differs in the overall outer appearance being closer to that of a Coleman 237 and that it has a single air tube.
It doesn't have positive shutoff valve.
As for the pip for footvalve, just any punched-out, kero-resistant sealing material, i.e., viton, buna-n or natural cork would do.

 

Which makes me question. There was a huge debate long ago about the dangers of running light volatiles such as gasoline and white gas in a lanterns that don't employ the use of a positive shut-off yet on the 238B leaflet, it says it's "Safe with petrol"

Would you still recommend running only kero/para?

 

Yes, my recommendation is only kero.
Actually it says: "Also can burn Lighting Petrol - with no adjustments needed".
(Well, any Petromax-styled lantern can do that as well...just not safely)...I think that's very different from "Safe with petrol"

I think there might be some disagreement for the statement: "Positive shut-off Valve eliminates re-pumping each time lantern is lighted".
I don't see any shut-off valve on the main fuel line. The only part that I would consider as positive shut-off would be the air stem in the pump tube. The footvalve certainly isn't one.
I'm not sure if it has the usual snorkel tube for the pump as with other Coleman.

 

Would you say the 238B was a superior design over petromaxes? It has a heat resistant aluminum vent and frame that doesn't tarnish as easily under high heat, Positive lock stem on pump with a snorkel that won't spray spray fuel when it fails like an NRV. And a positive locking rapid torch vs the compression toggle which won't bleed pressure overtime due to a bad pip.

Also because of the pump design, it's astronomically easier to pump up vs a petromax where you have to ram that thing to the point the mantle breaks.

 

When you consider the evidence of how many copies over many decades, from a host of manufacturers there have been of the Petromax design, the answer is not hard to figure out.

Imho, Coleman's pump plunger design is better than the Pmax design, but many Pmax clones used the Primus plunger design which is hard to beat for reliability.

Preston loop vaporisers have a much longer service interval than Coleman kerosene generators.

A 500HK Petromax has a much greater light output than a 500cp Coleman kerosene lantern.

The steel base plate on Coleman founts tend to rust through, whereas the Petromax is all brass.